312. Trust Building Exercises feat. Mick Hawes

Learn how to communicate your value to build trust

To be better understood we need to communicate better. Communicating comes with openness and honesty that will result in building trust. In this episode of the show, we are talking with Mick Hawes, who’s been in the game of performance and coaching for 30 years. He believes that by being open and honest as well as working together as a team always gives you the best results.

In this episode you will…

• Learn how Mick Hawes has been helping builders build successful businesses for 30 years
• Understand the basics of building trust and rapport with your audience
• Learn to gain trust from the clients you serve
• Take a deeper look personal development
• Hear us answer a question about value over price
• Hear us discuss the value of communicating correctly with our clients
• Understand why podcasting is a central pillar of success in business
• Hear us talk about openness and honesty
• Learn how his coaching program flourished throughout the pandemic
• Learn more because we talk in-depth about addressing mental health challenges

All this and more, on this week’s episode of  Should I Start A Podcast.

Make sure you listen to the end … I’ll break down this episode to give you 3 small steps you can execute right now to help you take this listening experience into execution experience. Also, if you know a business owner that needs to hear an episode about why a podcast is the best business development tool, please share an episode with them.

Pretty Please. Enjoy the show.

After you listen to this episode I would love you to take these 3 small steps that will help you communicate your value to build trust:

1. Write down what value and transformation you deliver to your clients
2. Make a list of testimonials
3. Publish your case studies and testimonials on every page on your website & in your sales process.

What you pick as your strategies to grow will depend on where you are at in your business. Pick the right strategy for where you are at and not where you want to be.

These are 3 small steps that if you execute, irrespective of where you are at in your business and podcasting journey will make a huge impact on your making your podcast more profitable & more impactful.

If this is the first episode you’ve listened to all the way to the end or if you are a regular, thank you … I love that you are here. Check out our back catalogue on  ShouldIStartAPodcast.com, subscribe to the show and give me a review and rating, it really helps us get found more.

If you are a business owner podcaster and want to join others just like you in a group where we share tactics & ideas on what’s working (or not) for us when it comes to using our podcast in the best possible way. For more on that go to wearepodcast.com/group … it is free.

Stay tuned next week when we going to talk with Dan Cumberland about defining success as a podcaster & business owner. We cover lots including defining your credibility and using AI to repurpose your content to video. So, don’t forget to subscribe to the show to get that episode as soon it gets released. Until then, much love.

👉🏽 BIO: Mick Hawes is transforming the building industry. He’s been involved in performance coaching in highest levels of sport and also in small business for over 30 years. He’s changing and eliminating destructive building industry norms to give both the builder and the client significantly more value and and a much more enjoyable, exciting experience when building, just as it should be!

Links & resources mentioned in the episode:

• https://buildersbusinessblackbelt.com.au/

 

Having worked with thousands of business owners to create a podcast for their business, I’ve created The Recurring Results Roadmap for Podcasters™.

It’s a step-by-step guide to growing your business to 7+ figures using your podcast.

Importantly, it removes the guesswork so you know exactly what to focus on at all times to generate that recurring revenue.

The best part? It’s personalised, free and it lets you get started straight away.

Download The Recurring Results Roadmap for Podcasters™ here.

If this is your first time here, this is Should I Start A Podcast. I’m Ronsley Vaz. Each week you’ll hear me, and a star-studded guest lineup, dig deep into the podcasting process. We’ll bring you tactics, tips and tricks to use in your own podcasting journey. We’ll teach you how to build an audience. And we’ll show you how to keep them coming back, show after show.

So if you want to start a podcast, or expand your current audience, this is the show for you.

Here is the transcript of the entire episode done by a.i. for those who like to read …

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

podcast, business, conversation, builders, selling, people, building, understand, trust, client, problem, sale, coaching, industry, ideal prospect, important, 1000s, results, construction industry, talking

SPEAKERS

Ronsley Vaz, Mick, Anna Vocino

Ronsley Vaz  00:08

indicator one, this is launch control. Please advise when the pre flight checklist is complete with indicator one flight is complete. All indicators read Green.

Anna Vocino  00:20

This is should I start a podcast, a show for business owners looking for tips, tricks and ingenious hacks when it comes to growing a business using their podcast. This is your host Ronsley. He’s interviewed more than 1400 people and has been listened to over 5 million times in 133 countries, a TED speaker, author and a podcast purist who believes that we can use our voices to grow our business and our influence, you know, because every conversion in any business always happens in a conversation. And now Ronsley. Ladies and gentlemen,

Ronsley Vaz  01:03

welcome to another live recording, or should I start a podcast today, we have make holes in the house, who is a legend who’s been in the game of performance and coaching for 30 years, we’re going to get his story. And me, as I call him is a reluctant podcaster. And I think he might agree with that he has been to different routes as a podcaster. And I’m keen to get the story. But he has seen a lot of businesses fail. He’s in a lot of businesses succeed. And he’s been doing this for 30 years. So I’m keen to get him on the show and hear his story. Mike, how you doing, buddy?

Mick  01:37

I’m doing excellent. Thanks.

Ronsley Vaz  01:39

I am keen to get started with the first business you had. What was that first business? And how did you get clients to that business?

Mick  01:48

Well, the first time I worked for myself, I woke up one day, and I’m sure most people have had this experience where you wake up and you just have this overwhelming urge to sell life insurance. And I went and did that. And that kind of got me started on the path of personal development, all that. And our first business that we started was actually a training business. And it was really hard to get clients back then. Because obviously you don’t know what you’re doing. And you’re just kind of door knocking and cold calling and you don’t really have a nation, you don’t really understand what your potential clients are looking for you kind of selling yourself and all of that sort of stuff doing pretty much everything wrong. So it’s quite difficult. But over the 30 years of doing this, I guess we’ve come to the conclusion that you do need to have a niche, you do need to understand the fears, frustrations, wants and aspirations of your ideal client. And the content they put out needs to resonate and enter into the conversation that your ideal prospects, if you like already having and in that sentence, so a couple of sentences that sort of learned 30 years,

Ronsley Vaz  02:53

which is supposed to be the basics of business. But when you go back to your selling days knocking on doors and not knowing your niche, but obviously at some point making some sort of sale, what was working back then, like what converted what works

Mick  03:06

back then because it was face to face, like there was no social media to speak of. So it was relationships. And I guess nothing has changed. Just the the medium has changed. But it was just relationships, getting to know people getting them to know you were genuine, and you had their best interests at heart and just developing relationships. Back then, as I said it was face to face today, it’s potentially a little more electronic. But I don’t think anything’s changed.

Ronsley Vaz  03:34

Interesting. So it’s basically about building trust. And that’s the name of the game. So you’ve been doing this for 30 years, you help builders build successful businesses, and you coach them to do that. Let’s talk about some of the bad recommendations you heal in your profession. What comes to mind,

Mick  03:51

in our industry, there’s a big focus on that you can’t charge for quotes. We teach all our guys that you need to get paid for putting that together and teach them how to do that. But the recommendations are you won’t get business if you charge for things that people previously have paid for or have gotten for free. And the other recommendation is that everyone makes decisions based on price. And in my world. There’s nothing further from the truth. Statistically, I believe that it’s like 80% of people want value, and 20% of the people making decisions based on price. My personal opinion is those other 20% make decisions based on value as well. They talk about price but it’s like in their mind when everything lines up. They feel they’re getting value so they go ahead so in my mind, it’s all about value. It’s never about price, but they’re the recommendations.

Ronsley Vaz  04:46

So when you’re talking about price are competing on price when they don’t really understand the value that they’re getting or they kind of only feel like it’s a like for like I wrote a quote down this morning or yesterday that read Art is not what you see. But what you make others see, maybe as business owners, we’re going to learn how we can make other car art. What in your experience has made that work? Like? How do people understand when you’re trying to explain them in a sales conversation? Like, this is my odd, what are the best ways to communicate that?

Mick  05:22

It always needs to be from their perspective, there are many things, and I’m gonna need to talk from a builders perspective, because they’re the people out to all of the time, the issue is that the builder is generally completely unaware of what their client’s desires and concerns are. They think they know them, but they don’t. And so the value that they put towards their client and their prospect represents value to them, the builder, I’m doing all of these things for you, you know, I’ll do this, we’ll use that. And we’ll get the sort of people who will use this technique and allow all of this sort of stuff that represents value to the builder. The reality is that the client doesn’t even know about it, probably, if they knew about it, they wouldn’t care about it. But what they do care about is when the builder understands, what are your concerns, what are you afraid of? What are you frustrated with? What are you scared of, and the beauty of just learning how to do this, or enter into this conversation where you are feeding back their fears, frustrations, wants and aspirations to them. So they feel that you understand from their perspective, equally as well, perhaps even better, than they understand it themselves. There’s a massive trust building exercise going on, then they lower their defenses, because something from a client’s point of view, most of them think that builders are already making too much money, they’re going to rip me off, if I tell them what my budget is, they’ll use it against all of this sort of stuff. And that might be true in some small parts of the industry. But by and large, it’s not true. And by being open and honest, and working together as a team, you’re always gonna get the best result, it all comes down to understanding from their perspective and having them feel that you understand from their perspective,

Ronsley Vaz  07:19

that’s such a big point that you bring up. And I think it’s like, that’s why reason I kind of went down this path I not knowing where it will go. But it’s such an important point. Because we do all these things for our clients, with the good intention of like, you don’t understand what is happening here, like how much I’m giving you here. And they, in return don’t understand that. So how do you like, take that into your content? How do you create content for your people?

Mick  07:47

If you believe in what I just said, that’s the first hurdle like you’ve got to believe that. But then, when you represent those activities, those actions that you’re taking for your client, when you’re communicating what you’re doing for them, it always has to be communicated in a way that they see the old WWI FM, what’s in it? For me? It needs to be expressed and communicated in a way, front and center? Is the value for them? How does it protect them? How does it support them? How does it guide them? How does it make their life better? How does it deliver value? Rather than we do this? You know, we do all of this editing. And we do you know, whatever you do and amplify what is the specific value point from their perspective that they experienced, because you perform that activity is the way that it needs to be explained, for example, with their builders, most people are used to getting a builder around, here’s my plans, do a quote, it’s for free, you’re up against it, when you go, Well, there’s a fee for that, and they’re going but but I can get 10 other builders to do it for nothing. So you’ve got to be able to communicate the value of what you’re doing from their perspective. So it makes sense to pay. And that’s kind of a big ask. And one of the things that I suggest, if anybody listening to this has this issue is I use the analogy and you brought up the restaurants. Everyone has a favorite restaurant, you go there twice a week, everyone knows you there, good food, all that sort of stuff and you turn up one week and the prices are 30%. Higher, nothing’s changed. You’ll probably get the shits about that. But if you went there one day, and they said Mr. Vyas We’re so glad that you’re here. We’ve got some exciting news for you. And we’re really looking forward to what you’ve got to say. At the end of the evening. We’ve revamped the place we’ve got new furniture the chef’s been out sourcing all of this incredible organic produce is rewritten the menu we’ve got this dude that matches the wine with the food. We’ve got entertainment in the corner, but change the lighting the whole ambiance is significantly different. And we cannot wait for you to tell us of your experience at the end of the evening. And you look on the menu, and it is all different and a 30 present dearer than used to beat you don’t even blink. Because you’ve had such a different experience, you can’t charge more for the same menu, you’ve got to change the menu, you’ve got to change the experience, then charge appropriately and they go Fair enough.

Ronsley Vaz  10:24

I wonder whether selling is such an important part of business in general, that you could create the best content or the best podcast or the best business development tool, if your conversion into sales, whether it is selling for sponsors on your podcast, or selling for clients, or selling for more books, or whatever it might be something for your brand, all that needs to be achieved some sort of selling needs to happen? And do you think that business owners kind of get into this kind of feeling that they are not going to sell anymore, because now they have a podcast, or now they have a book or now they have a blog, or now they have a video channel?

Mick  10:59

Yeah, I get a sense that the majority of people feel that selling has a geeky, nasty reputation anyway. So they can come up with all sorts of reasons as to not do it. But at the end of the day, there isn’t a business until and unless a sale is made. So we need to sell in every business. And I think it’s a bit of a mistake. When you think that if my product or my service is good enough, it will sell itself. I think that there’s a lot of businesses that have gone broke with amazing products and amazing services, I can understand it because I went through that myself years and years and years ago, I remember like it was yesterday having a conversation with a buddy of mine at Sydney Airport. And he was suggesting that I go into a sales role at that point, I was just finished being a professional musician, I was working in a musical shop. And I was a professional sound engineer and all of this sort of thing. And he suggested going into sales, and I just reeled in terror and disgust as if I would do that I’d be awful, and all that sort of stuff. And, and now I kind of teach it. And I think it’s the most important skill that we have in life. Because every time we get into a discussion with somebody, there’s a sale that needs to be made. If I have a disagreement with somebody, or I want to change somebody’s perception of something to benefit them even. I’m selling a difference of opinion. So you’ve got to understand how the sales process works. And I think some of the best stuff I’ve learned, his all selling is creating trust and transferring a feeling or transferring an emotion. And what I mean by that is going full circle to what you said a little while ago. It’s all about trust. And I’m in the family. And you message me and you said you should join this and like to be and I’ve never told you this before. So I’m just being completely transparent. I didn’t know what you’re talking about. You said something about podcasts and something about something else. And no, and yeah, and honestly, all I thought was if Ron’s reckons it’s a good idea for me to be in this group. I’ll just jump in. And I’ll figure it out as I’m going along. And it was great. But my point is that you made the sale because we had an incredible level of trust.

13:23

Hey, this is Katerina Jubeir. I’m a creator podcaster and maker of amazing videos. I’m on the inside of we are podcast members, or as we call it, the webinar. If you were thinking about growing your business using a podcast, and your online presence, come join us on the inside. I would love to meet you, James and Ronsley coaches to get those reoccurring results in our businesses. If you want the roadmap, which we all follow to get those results, you can download it by following this link. roadmap.we are podcast.com. Now here’s Ronsley.

Ronsley Vaz  14:02

So what has been your podcast journey? What? When did you start because you’ve done a few reps in terms of recordings and even publishing. What has that journey been like? And where are you at now?

Mick  14:14

I started doing a podcast maybe 12 years ago or something 10 years ago, and just got so sucked into the production of it and finding the guests and sponsors and all of this sort of stuff. And I was with an American company. So my business was in Australia, but there was an American podcast company that I was with. And they would promote it and syndicate it all through the United States. And we were getting 1000s and 1000s and 1000s of downloads every week. And it didn’t help my business a bit. Because then the United States and we were here, and it took me a whole year to go well. Hang on. What am I doing? This is crazy. And I’ve had a few attempts at podcast thing since. And then I joined the family. And then it started to make sense to really understand your purpose for the podcast. And when you’ve got the purpose, it makes all of the work that needs to be done to pull a podcast together. So worth it as we speak. Now, the podcast is such a central pillar of the success of our business because it creates that connection that trust, every person that comes along, that is a prospect to our company, which is the builders business blackbelt coaching the builders and other trades based businesses without being asked, they all volunteer, I’ve been listening to the podcast, I love what’s going on in the podcast. And it’s such a central part of the success of the current business, by building that trust and rapport before we even get to meet them. So I can’t recommend it highly enough. We’re about to launch into a second podcast and we had a session the other day, and I, there’s so much I need to learn. I thought I knew what I was doing. And it turns out that that’s the most important thing to get across to the podcast anyway,

Ronsley Vaz  16:10

it’s fascinating to hear your background in terms of how technical you actually are in all things audio, and still are humble enough to kind of go I don’t know, a lot of other things. And I feel that’s probably been the biggest highlight for me when it comes to you is like you’re constantly in this learning phase, which is so, so cool. What are some of the results that you’ve gotten directly from the podcast for your business? Like, what are the some of the things that you can like say, Well, this is a direct result of having the podcast?

Mick  16:42

Well, right now, it’s simply lead generation, we’ve built a community, we’ve got our own app built called the tool shed, and we attract builders in there. And the podcast is the single, most influential part of that environment, causes people to have a conversation with us, and look at joining our paid programs. So it’s the most central part of our business. And I can’t sort of emphasize how important and how powerful it is. And then the other thing that I’ve learned through this journey, as well is you just said to be open and always learning. And you called me one time and said, Your builders need to be doing podcasts and I said, Oh, I think you’re barking up the wrong tree. They’re all filler builders won’t do a podcast and I introduced it, you gave me some reasons as to why it would be a good idea. Again, the trust factor kicked in. And I mentioned that to some of our members who took up the mantle created their own podcast got together did a joint podcasts or whatever. And their feedback is exactly the same. They said they can’t believe how many problems it’s gotten rid of in their building business. Because when they meet their prospect for the first time, their prospects have this really high level of trust and say things like, I feel like I’ve known you for a long time. I feel like I’ve known you forever, because they’ve seen you and heard you in the podcast. And you’ve already created that connection that trust the rapport. And that’s so profound. I mean, how much does it cost to get a client into your business these days. And if you can have a resource in your business that just rips down all of those walls of suspicion and distrust. So you can just have a proper conversation about what their problem is, and will your solution suit their problem. It saves time, it saves effort, they have a much better experience. I mean, it’s just a horrible experience for a consumer trying to find their way to find the right service provider or the right product to fix their problem. It’s not great being a consumer. But when you can find somebody who you really, really trust and can guide you. It’s wonderful. And the podcast can do that for you.

Ronsley Vaz  18:58

Let’s talk about what you’re doing and how, for your instance like talk about who your audience is, and then how you’re structuring the podcast to get a client and then what’s happening when, when all that happens, like just explain or break down the whole model for us.

Mick  19:14

So currently, we’re getting into conversations with other bigger organizations who have a focus on helping people in the construction industry with mental health. And over the last half a year or something that’s been a blinding flash of the obvious for us as well. Like we’ve got an amazing coaching program that has helped builders, one of them called me just two weeks ago, and he’s only been with us two years, implemented the Profit First system after he started with us and throughout the COVID epidemic. This particular builder has put a million dollars of cash in the profit account, which is an amazing outcome. But the reason I said that is just to give you some sort of evidence that we know what we’re talking about We do good results. But the stuff that we teach needs to be put into practice. And if you have so much distress and your mental health is suffering that you can’t really give time or attention to the stuff that’s going to help you build a bigger, better business, nothing happens. So our coaching program is fundamentally worthless until and unless we address the mental health issues, and they’re massive in the building industry in the construction industry. So we’re now having conversations with these larger organizations, about how we can come together to help people in the industry address the mental health challenges, because it is massive, one of the biggest house building companies just a few months ago, I think they had like 2000 houses in the ground at the time, and the owner of that organization killed himself, it’s just so so disturbing, and this sort of stuff is going on far too often. And so we’re having conversations with these people as to how we can work together to do that. And one of the first things we’re doing is, let’s get you on the podcast, and let’s talk about that. And so us and them are talking about something that’s very, very important and something we all have a passion for. And so, by finding that really common topic to have the conversation about, there’s no resistance in them sharing that conversation through their networks, through their social through their database, that creates awareness for us. And we’re doing the same for them. So having that that central purpose with the people you’re talking to, I think, has made a lot of sense to us. And people are just lining up to jump onto this podcast that doesn’t exist yet.

Ronsley Vaz  21:45

Entrepreneurship one on one, like, see, yes, and then build it, there’s always a plan. And I love how it’s all coming together. Because it’s, it is the right time, it seems like the topic that you’re talking about is so important. And I already have a couple of guests that I think would be perfect for the show from an angle of help with the mental health aspect. But then when I started to break down what you’re doing, so you’re being kind of the hub for builders in Australia, being the center around a topic that has not been spoken about enough. And you’re being the voice and the champion for that. And ultimately, that’s going to lead them to have better state of mind, which leads them to have a better business, which leads to them being open to be coached is, am I right is sort of breaking that down.

Mick  22:30

Yeah, that’s all part of the process that if there is just something that is pressing on you so badly, you can have the best advice, best direction in the world right in front of your face, but you just can’t pay any attention to it. It’s like if you’re in the water, drowning, and you can’t get a breath, and I’m trying to get you to relax, because when you’re relaxed, you can slow your heart rate down and you don’t need as much oxygen and you won’t drown as quickly, you’re probably not gonna listen to me, you’re just so panicked. And something else is pressing on you so much, you can’t listen to reason. And that’s what I’m seeing in the industry and also the importance of conversations. And that’s why the podcast is such an important medium to put your message out on because the importance of conversations within the industry is going to be the answer to fixing the majority of the problems that are in the industry, because everyone’s in their own little silo. So the you’ve got the building designers and architects and there’s and you’ve got the different trades in theirs, and the suppliers in theirs and the builder in there’s and everyone’s just struggling to try and do the best they can for their own business, not realizing that how they’re running their business is causing problems for all of those other businesses that are in the industry. And so we need to start to get conversations going between all of these different parts of the industry so they can start to go, Oh, I didn’t realize how I was doing things was causing problems for you. Let’s stop doing it. That way, we’ll come up with a better way of doing it. And then potentially they will change how they’re doing things that are causing problems for this business and other businesses. So conversations are so incredibly vital. And I cannot think of a better medium than a podcast to have these conversations on.

Ronsley Vaz  24:26

Make. I’m curious to know what you see as mistakes that people make when it comes to selling to the audience.

Mick  24:33

The big one is that they see a problem. They have a solution to the problem. And then they put it in front of the person, their prospect or their market in a manner that it’s from their perspective, and they make the mistake of not figuring out what’s going on for their ideal prospect. So a couple of things that they don’t identify who their ideal prospect is for because you can’t really do the second bit, which is understanding them until you’ve identified your ideal prospect first, because just the age thing, like when you’re creating a, an avatar for your ideal prospect, what I’ve always been taught is pick an age, and maybe even pick a sex. And I That’s all a hot topic right now. But you know what I mean. So, if we just look at the age thing for a moment, if someone says our ideal customer is in the age group between 35, and 50, or even 35, and 45, having been all three of those ages, in the past, your life, your preferences, and your priorities are extraordinarily different. Between 35 and 45. They’re extraordinarily different between 35 and 40. They’re very different between 45 and 50. So getting very, very clear on who your ideal prospect is, first is really important, because then you can start to understand what is keeping them up at night, what is the conversation that they’re already having inside their own mind, so you can enter into it with your topics and your conversations on your podcasts and your messaging, and so on and so forth. A very good friend of mine, one of my very first mentors, when I woke up that fateful morning, deciding that life insurance was a really great idea helped me run one of our intensives, just a couple of weeks ago, up at the Gold Coast. And he had this saying that said, Get in their bed get in their head, which caused a chuckle when he first said it because people didn’t really understand what he’s talking about. What he meant by that, is the conversation that’s going around in somebody’s head, when they first wake up, have a morning, they’re kind of lying in bed and or they’re falling asleep, that’s gold, that what’s going on in their mind at those two times in their day, are generally really, really important to them. And if your messaging and your topics in your conversations in your podcasting in your marketing, is entering into the conversations that they’re having in their bed, it really resonates with them. So they will lean into it, they will sit up and take notice of what you’re talking about. Because it resonates with them, it will seem like it’s very, very important to them. So you start to attract the exact right person into your podcast and therefore, into your business if you do it that way. But if you just have a solution to a problem that you observe, there’s a fair chance that it will be a really, really hard sell. Because number one, they might not have accepted or realize that they have that problem. They experience the potentially the problems that that problem creates, like they feel frustrated, or they feel like they waste their time or whatever it is. But they haven’t put two and two together and haven’t identified what the problem is. So they’re not even searching for your solution. So you can talk about it all you like, it’s just not gonna connect, we’ve got to get, as Ian said, in their bed, get in their head, understand what their priorities and preferences are, and enter into that conversation. Yeah,

Ronsley Vaz  28:19

so cool. Before we wind up what kind of tricks and tips you might have for like someone starting a podcast, or is new to the podcasting world? What sort of advice would you give someone?

Mick  28:32

Don’t do it how I did it? That’s a really, really tough question. Because I feel like just this week, I got all of this new information that that’s been given to me for the last two years, probably about really, what is the purpose of your podcast? Like really? And genuinely, what is the purpose of your podcast? So you can then start to think about what I just talked about? Who’s your ideal listener? And yeah, I think that planning its purpose, planning, its structure. And just getting into really understanding the purpose and the structure upfront is the most important thing that you could do. Because was it yesterday? I know it was this week, you’re asking me all these questions. I said, Yeah, I know. Yep. I know. Yeah, I know that er, know that. And then you put this whole lot of stuff in front of me. I went Ah, shit, I don’t know any of that. And all of that stuff was more important than the stuff I already knew. So, structure, purpose. If we can go back to our mistake, what sort of equipment do I get none of that sort of stuff. And I’m just mad with all of that sort of stuff. And it’s the least important

Ronsley Vaz  29:40

really, yeah. You on the coaching call when I fix someone’s problem with because they didn’t have a good microphone literally on the spot because she didn’t need anything fancy. She literally could recall of zoom off her phone with the iPhone plugs so I think we get too fancy with the equipment. And I love that you said, because you’re like pretty anal when it comes to audio. Anyway, let me wind up on this. Where can people find you? And where can people find your work?

Mick  30:09

Our website is builders business blackbelt.com.au. And you can jump on the App Store or Google Play and find the tool shed. So if you’re involved in the construction industry, we’re trying to create an environment for anybody and everybody in the construction industry, so we can start to have these conversations and make everybody businesses better. That’s the website, builders business. blackbelt.com. That Are you.

Ronsley Vaz  30:38

Amazing. Make this has been awesome. Thank you so much for everything being a great case study as always, and keeping on the good fight. So I’m extremely lucky to have you in my life, and extremely lucky to see your journey, however young, you might look. So thank you,

Mick  30:56

thank you. And back at you, when we first met, and you were the podcast Guru, I thought, Oh, that’s nice runs. And I didn’t think that there was any value in it for me. And all I can say standing here today is there’s been so much value in it. For me, it has affected so many other people’s lives. Because we do a podcast. Don’t underestimate the power of

Ronsley Vaz  31:20

so good to hear that. Thank you MC toxin. All right. So you still till the end, you found this useful, and you have a business. And, Paul, you have a podcast and a business. And you kind of want to make it work for you and grow your business using this podcast will. You know what, that’s something that I have helped 1000s of people do and 1000s of businesses do in different forms, through an agency in a one on one fashion through a conference in the group and obviously courses and stuff. So please, I want to be able to give you something that you can use to get recording results in your business using a podcast. We call it the recurring results roadmap. It is years of putting this in practice. It is the blueprint to get results in recurring results using our podcast if you’d like that, send me a message [email protected] I want to hear from you. I want to hear your voice or I want to hear from you. So if you’ve listened to this and you want that roadmap, please send me an email [email protected] I want to hear from you. Much love. I’ll see you in the next episode.

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